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Forum :: Mods / Repairs

TB 2000 neck bowed?


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mcbassdude

Joined:
22 Jun 2011
Posts: 3
PostPosted: 06/22/2011 at 4:32 PM    Post subject: TB 2000 neck bowed? link

I have #462 and I have taken it to a shop to restore it. I was told the neck has a back bow (un-stringed). No truss rod of course. Is this normal. Will the tension of the strings correct this? Is there any way to correct this?

Also, is there any where to get replacements for the tuners?

I appreciate any help.

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gse1

Joined:
09 Jun 2005
Posts: 27
PostPosted: 06/24/2011 at 1:20 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Does your 2000 have a thicker timber fret board or the aluminium and timber fret board ( it will be about 2mm of timber and 2mm of aluminium. If it is only a slight back bow and you have the thicker timber fretboard you maybe able to have the frets removed and have the fret board sanded true again and have it refretted. if it is the thinner timber and aluminium fret board there maybe less play to do this as i beleive the bottom of the frets actually sit on the aluminium. It could still be done it would be just trickier.this is only my 2cents worth, i have built a couple of aluminium guitars and my last one has the slightest of back bows but the guy who did the frets manged to sort this out in the fretwork. Best thing to do as most people would probably suggest is to get in touch with Kevin from electrical guitar company as he builds beautiful aluminium guitars and I beleive has fixed/ restored many beans for people.
http://www.electricalguitarcompany.com/

Cheers
Gary

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quimbymeat

Joined:
12 Feb 2010
Posts: 23
PostPosted: 06/24/2011 at 6:52 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

http://bass-mechaniken.de.....Cabf7e64X130c1983c23X78a0

go on ebay or tell a guitar store to get you a set of these Schaller, I got a set as when my Bean arrived on of the pegs was hanging off. I have all the original's as a back up.

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mcbassdude

Joined:
22 Jun 2011
Posts: 3
PostPosted: 06/24/2011 at 9:15 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Thank you. I was able to get the tuners thru All Parts. Can't find any that don't have schaller stamped in though. I think those were made special for TB. Having the brass nut made for me.

I can't find anything regarding a back bow on the neck. Are the necks straight unstrung?

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gse1

Joined:
09 Jun 2005
Posts: 27
PostPosted: 06/24/2011 at 3:32 PM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

With my first guitar I made the neck was dead flat when unstrung. when strung it has the slightest neck releif which works out well. I am only guessing when it comes to a bass but i would say the principle is the same. Again i am only making a slightly educated bass. I would again strongly suggest getting in contact with Kevin at egc. He is very pleasent, helpful and knowegable.
Good luck

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gse1

Joined:
09 Jun 2005
Posts: 27
PostPosted: 06/24/2011 at 3:34 PM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

that should have said "educated guess, not educated bass"


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scalemodelguitars

Joined:
20 Jul 2011
Posts: 6
PostPosted: 07/21/2011 at 7:55 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Hello, my name is Dave Johnson and I work as a guitar repair tech at Gruhn Guitars in Nashville, TN. I actually joined this message board to respond to this post as I have worked on a number of Travis Bean guitars and might be able to give some insight as to how these necks work.
There are two principles regarding guitar necks that you need to understand in order to properly set up an instrument, the first is string deflection and the second is neck relief. String deflection is very simple...when you put your guitar up to pitch, the neck is going to bow-forward due to having 100+ pounds of string tension applied to it (a bass might have much more given your tuning and string gauge). Neck relief is a measurement of exactly how much the strings are deflecting the neck, this is very important to the end result of how the guitar will play after being set up. If you have a substantial amount of neck relief, then you will probably notice that the action will be higher (especially in the middle of the neck). Not enough neck relief and you will notice "buzzing" and maybe even dead notes. A really fast way to "eyeball" a neck to see if the neck relief is in the ballpark is to hold the guitar as if you are playing it, hold down the first fret on the low "E" with your fretting hand (therefore taking the nut out of the equation), and then also fret the 13th fret with your picking hand. This essentially turns the string into a straight edge. You should notice a space between the top of the 6th fret and the bottom of the string. I try to shoot for the thickness of a medium pick when I set up a guitar (maybe slightly more for a bass). If there is excessive space, or no space at all, then you might have a problem. The very first thing that you should do with this bass is to put your preferred string set on it and see what happens to the neck when tuned up to pitch. It will deflect, the question is how much.
If a Travis Bean had an adjustable truss rod, then setting the correct amount of neck relief would be a few turns of the truss wrench away...not so easy with a non-adjustable neck. The way that you add or subtract neck relief is by manipulating the fret tang (this is the part of the fret wire below the crown that holds onto the fretboard, the vertical part of the fret wire that has "teeth"). If you want to add neck relief, creating more bow, then you remove material from the sides of the fret tang (creating smaller teeth). If you want to straighten-out the neck and subtract relief, then you expand the thickness of the fret tang by crimping it (creating bigger teeth). Every TB that I have ever worked on has always had a neck that back-bows when not under string tension. I am pretty sure that they designed these guitars this way in order to compensate for the lack of adjustable truss rod (the neck itself IS a non-adjustable truss rod). The good news is that once you dial-in the frets, the neck should be free of warpage issues for all eternity.
A previous poster had mentioned the possibility of removing material from the center of the fretboard and planing flat in order to compensate for excessive back-bow. I have never had to do this with any of my TB refrets, but if you do in fact have to do this, be very careful not to remove too much material from the middle. Fretboards also carry string tension, and removing too much material might result in a neck that "dips" in the middle when the neck deflects under string tension. You might be better off using fretwire with a taller crown and then get a solid fret level, therefore "cheating" the fretboard.
Hope that this is useful information!

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mcbassdude

Joined:
22 Jun 2011
Posts: 3
PostPosted: 07/21/2011 at 11:25 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Wow, Thank you for that reply. Very helpful info. Relieved to hear that my neck is not an anomaly but designed that way. I will take it to my guitar tech and have the frets worked after I show him this post. Cheers!

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scalemodelguitars

Joined:
20 Jul 2011
Posts: 6
PostPosted: 07/21/2011 at 11:02 PM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Glad that you find this info helpful! I would bet that once your bass is strung-up to pitch, that neck will jump right back into proper relief without any fretwork needed (apart from maybe a routine fret level/dressing). Just wanted to give suggestions in the event that the neck doesn't set up exactly the way you like it. I have worked on dozens of these and have never encountered a warped or bowed neck on any of them. Travis Bean guitars do however have an issue with fretboards lifting off of the neck. I have had to remove and re-glue them, and it can be an intimidating process since you have to use epoxy to get proper adhesion (which is a one-shot deal). The next time one comes through the shop I will document the process and post a link on this board.
Best of luck!

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colinm

Joined:
10 Jul 2011
Posts: 3
PostPosted: 07/22/2011 at 7:04 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

just looked in a found this thread,my bass is 468 (tb200)
and had a neck problem not long after i got the bass in 1976,
i was sent to one of the top guys here in australia
he found that the frettboard got moisture in the grain ,as sydney was more humid than in the usa where it was made and has streched the neck and it was fretting up to the 3rd frett,
instead of refinishing the frettboard he just dried it out and sealed it with some shelac,
never had a problem since in all its 35 odd years on the road,
still the best bass ive own'd,even that alembic only lasted 2 years!!
all the best colin


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rlrlrl

Joined:
24 Dec 2007
Posts: 260
PostPosted: 07/22/2011 at 8:58 PM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

haven't posted here in ages (but I still read, hey folks). scalemodel, great post. I did not know this, about the adjustments you can do with the tang, and it's fascinating. I wonder how many local guitar techs know how to do this, or if it's something that's more specialized for advanced shops.

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Kevin

Joined:
16 Mar 2007
Posts: 147
PostPosted: 07/23/2011 at 9:41 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

I emailed you about a month ago and never heard anything back, but heres what I sent:


"I have a few of the reissue TB2000s and they all had some form of back bow with out strings...not sure if the machinist did this on purpose or not. But as far as the originals like yours, Ive never seen one like that. Basically the metal relieved itself at some point generally during machining from the start. I doubt it was bent at some point as that would take an incredible amount of pressure.

The fix is a toss up. I would first try putting the strings on and seeing if this helps, I think this will fix it as i said above, metal relieves in machining and if it happened then, this back bow has been there forever and the strings must have pulled it straight.

The next thing is re leveling the frets to get rid of this back bow, this is what i had to do with the reissues, you can even go as far as re leveling the fretboard if your going to re fret the bass. This can be done by any luthier and its pretty easy. Also too, I remember Bean saying they eventually started making the fret slots over sized as when they drove the frets in each one would act like a mini wedge a cause a back bow(very slight), but one none the less.

The final and most tricky is to machine the back bow out. This wasn't an option on the reissues, they are so thin it would have chattered like hell. The regular Tbs are pretty thick, so its possible, but i would recommend all of the above vs this option. If the back bow is really extreme this will be the only viable option to fix it.

Theres no real way to bend it back as is, you'll case more damage than good."


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Kevin

Joined:
16 Mar 2007
Posts: 147
PostPosted: 07/23/2011 at 9:44 AM    Post subject: RE:TB 2000 neck bowed? link

Last, by relieving I mean this. When you start with a billet and make heavy cuts the metal will twist and bend, the thinner you get it, the more this happens. It can be compensated for, but it happens naturally.

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